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5. OLD BUSINESS'(Cont'd) Mr. Louis Wilcox said that as to the substantial participation, the answer was "No." However., there was some. The meeting was a free and open-meeting'and Mr. Oesterling of''C1yde E. Williams & Associates presented the various plans at the meeting and made the explanations very simple and took an adequate amount of time to explain many of the questions that were asked, and that there was a substantial number. Commissioner Wiggins asked if the feeling was pretty generally in accord with the motion that was made and that has been presented to the Commission here, to which Mr. Wilcox replied, "I would say, yes. President Nimtz said that we can get into a discussion from now until Noon about this stage, and we don't want to do that at this time, but stated to Mr. Soltesz, "I know that one of the big dis- agreements is going to be concerning the proposed stage and what the estimate is. As I understand it, you have a figure of around $37,000 and, of course, I think we have had a figure of`anywhere's up to $200,000 ?" Mr. Brownell said, "the cost is stated in differ- ent ways: One of the costs that the architect thinks it will be, is a continuing cost each year, of up to close to $50,000 a year, and, I think, this has to be explored and we have to find out where we are going to land, before we can proceed with it, and I have asked Mr. Oesterling to make himself available -- either before or at our next Commission meeting." President Nimtz asked Mr. Soltesz if he could be available for con- sultation and Mr. Soltesz said that he can be. The Chair asked Mr. Soltesz to state his position on this stage, as he knows there was some discussion at the Advisory Meeting on this subject. Mr. Soltesz stated: "I would only like to say this: That if those of us that are involved in industry had to forecast our expenditures in a manner in which this was presented, and I happen to know, as an adversary of mine is sitting across the table there - -Mr. C. Wayne Brownell- -that if these figures that were presented to us would be accurate, none of us would be in business here, and we would be manufacturing nothing here in the City of South Bend, or St. Joseph County::: That is my only comment that I have to make." President Nimti stated that he is sure that the Commissioners will go into this very thoroughly because we want to do what needs to be done there, and Mr. Soltesz replied: "I know you do, Mr. Chairman." The President said we are in a great divergence here on costs. Mr. Brownell said he wanted to explain Ed's remark: "Ed represented the union, and I represented the management." The Chair asked Mr. Soltesz, "What about relocation of the utilities down there ?" and Mr. Soltesz said, "I do not think it is apropros." The Chair's question on whether he has talked it over with Mr. Oester- ling, Mr. Soltesz advised, "Yes, we have talked about it and we have talked it over several months, and it hasn't been a problem, and much to our surprise, the costs for moving all of these items ... but one thing - 17 -