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Home My WebLink AboutSM 04-20-78SOUTH BEND REDEVELOPMENT COMMISSION County -City Building - Room 1200 227 West Jefferson Boulevard South Bend, Indiana 46601 COMMISSIONERS' SPECIAL MEETING Thursday, April 20, 1978 10:00 A.M. PRESIDING OFFICER: F. Jay Nimtz, President 1. ROLL Commissioners: F. Jay Nimtz, President Donald A. Wiggins, Vice President Peter A. Donaldson, Secretary Lloyd E. Robinson,Sr., Member Legal News Counsel: Kevin J. Butler Media: David W. Anderson, Reporter, WNDU -TV Dick Nemeth, Photographer, WNDU -TV Jeanne Derbeck, Reporter, South Bend Tribune Guests: Community Development Staff: LPA $taff: 2. APPROVAL OF MINUTES Henry Allen, Housing Contractor Tony Scott, Housing Contractor James M. Harcus Ken Schaller Kathy Baumgartner C. Wayne Brownell Marc Brammer Gertrude E. Barth Jane A. Zimmerman Mr. Nimtz pointed out a correction that should be made in the minutes of Apri 7, 1978. The Correction: "Mr. Westmoreland of Cincinnati is being brought here during the Historic Preservation Week by the Historic Preser- vation Commission." With this correction noted, the Minutes of April 7, 1978, were approved as mailed. 3. APPROVAL OF CLAIMS On m tion by Mr. Wiggins, seconded by Mr. Robinson and carried, claims in the mount of $24,947.99 were approved as submitted, and were allowed and orde ed paid, as follows: South Bend Redevelopment Commission Special eting - April 20, 1978 3. APPROVAL OF CLAIMS (Cont'd) REDEVELOPMENT REVOLVING FUND Payroll: 3 -25 -78 to 4 -7 -78 The Bobbs Merrill Company, Inc. Dorothy Z. Deane - Petty Cash I.B.P. Corporation Indiana Bell Telephone Company James R. Meehan & Associates Schillings' Sales Company, Inc. Xerox Corporation Indiana University at South Bend, Conferences and Institutes $ 3,045.20 61.50 64.11 232.80 186.60 21.40 30.02 67.09 TOTAL $ 3,783.72 P.E.P. R -66 Kevin J. Butler $ 1,078.25 Ronald E. Gettel 9,500.00 TOTAL $10,578.25 312 UOANS Abstract Company of St. Joseph County, Inc. $ 118.50 Barnes Electric Company 1,161.00 Barnes Electric Company 969.00 R.E. Carlton Plumbing 109.43 R.E. Carlton Plumbing 1,471.89 Tom Ford Home Improvement 285.00 Plaia Construction Company 4,457.00 Hubert L. Weaver 50.00 Charles Brown Maintenance Service 550.00 The ainters 1,400.00 TOTAL $10,571.82 RE Do ELOPMENT DISTRICT CAPITAL Z. Deane - Petty Cash TOTAL GRAND TOTAL -2- $ 14.20 $ 14.20 $24,947.99 South Be d Redevelopment Commission Special eeting April 20, 1978 4. COMM NICATIONS Ther were no communications to bring before the Commission. 5. OLD 3USINESS Ther was no old business to bring before the Commission. b. NEW 13USINESS a. leguest for Commission Approval of bids for contract award, as ecommended by the North Advisory Board, subject to legal counsel eview and South Bend Common'Council approval, as follows: RACT SET #04 I eneral Construction: Jurtin's Construction -- $18,786.00 Ir. Brownell: A bid tabulation sheet is included in your packets Indicating that there were five bidders: Plaia Construction, Liver Bend Remodeling, Jurtin's Construction, Charles Brown laintenance Company, Inc., and Brittain's Construction. Ir. Robinson: I would like to know what wage scale for various trades was involved in this decision? What were they bidding this >roject on? Ir. Harcus: The prevailing wages, contained in the packets, are :hose that have been outstanding now for a year. 4r. Robinson: In whose packet? 9r. Harcus: In the contract packet from the Housing Bureau. Ir. Robinson: What are those wage scales, can you tell me that? Ir. Harcus: Yes, sir, I have them right here. 9r. Robinson: Mr. Harcus, I can tell you point blank that this is not 'he wage scale for electricians, and I can testify to this first hand. [ know it is not the wage scale for some of the others, and we just )verturned the wage scale as we were fighting the congressman's brother, ind it hasn't been that long ago. Now, I also have on record in my )ffice various jobs that HUD has approved at our higher wage scale, so [ find it hard to believe that it is the proper wage scale and this 'ommission passed a resolution that the current wage scale in the area vould be paid. So I disagree with this. -3- South B Special d Redevelopment Commission eeting - April 20, 1978 6. NEW OUSINESS (Cont'd r. Harcus: In response to your request of prior meetings, I ollowed proper procedure and sent a prevailing wage determination equest to HUD and they are, according to requirement, supposed to espond within 45 to 50 days from the request. I have so entered he request on your behalf, and on our behalf at least four times n the last three weeks so I am attempting to represent you sir nd have it resolved. r. Robinson: Additionally, we have tried for years and years to et a lot more contractors interested in bidding this type work nd needless to say, it has been a tremendous effort on several eople's parts, and it seems to me, we are starting to have some uccess, whether it be the economic situation in our area or hatever. Most of the time we are lucky if we have two bidders on hese projects, and if you are going to continue in this direction, e are going to continuously have a lower wage rate than necessary. believe we are going to discourage the people who are trying to id. I find it a little hard to believe that we are presented ith something that is not the current wage rate as established by his Commission. I am telling you the same thing that I have told ou before; it looks to me like you are talking out of both sides f your mouth. On the other hand, we are trying to help people o improve their homes and some of these people are the same ones ho might be the mechanics on the job. You are giving with the eft hand and taking away with the right. I think this is totally nacceptable. r. Harcus: I don't think I am really talking out of two sides of y mouth sir. I have represented you conscientiously, and I am bliged to process the award (of the contract) in a timely manner, ccording to the information on hand. I do not, and with any uthority, can state that the prevailing wages are wrong. I must bide by the rulings of HUD. I have represented the Redevelopment ommission, and have processed expeditiously and followed up ggressively. r. Nimtz: (Mr. Butler had just arrived). What we are discussing ow (directing this to Mr. Butler) is the general construction contract id, where Jurtin's was the low bidder; and Mr. Robinson has raised he question about the prevailing wage scale. What are our alternatives n this? r. Butler: Is there apparently some question as to whether the revailing wage schedule that we now have is accurate? in South B Special Redevelopment Commission ting - April 20 1978 6. NEW OUSINESS (Cont'd . Nimtz: The question is whether the prevailing wage is being id and if they are following it. . Brownell: I believe Mr. Harcus would like to answer that question. r. Harcus: I believe it will be fair for everyone to understand he predicament I am in. The predicament I am in is that HUD is elling me that I am in non - compliance by having the prevailing age requirement in our specifications, so I am caught on both ides. If I may read to the Redevelopment Commission Sir; the hrase that is used in their regulations and it reads..... Prevailing Wages ". This section shall apply to the rehabilitation f residential property only if such property is designed for esidential use of eight or more families. My posture has been hat we have interpreted that to be that "this section shall" means... it will be done "; but as long as the phrase "only "is included in his phrase, that as a local city package that gives us only the ,etermination to have a selected power..that we can select whether ,r not we use it because the word "only" is in there. So I have .aken the position that we want prevailing wages because the word only" gives us latitude to determine what is preferable for our A ty and that is how I have represented the Redevelopment Commission. r. Butler: If the residential facility is for fewer than eight amilies. ....... r. Harcus: Then, they say you are not allowed to specify. r. Butler: You are saying that your interpretation has been that e may do it if we so desire? Ir. Harcus: Correct. Ir. Butler: It is a matter of local option. Ir. Wiggins: They are saying we don't have to. Ir. Butler: No, they are saying we can't. Our interpretation is that �e don't have to, but we may. Ir. Nimtz: I believe HUD is saying we can't include that in there. 1r. Butler: Have they submitted anything to you in writing at this )oi nt? -5- South B�nd. Redevelopment Commission Special Meeting - April 20, 1978 6. NEWIBUSINESS,(Continued Mr. Harcus: HUD just keeps sending me different sections. I talked with Mr. Dew and said .. "Sir, you have 45 days from my entry of a request to respond, you are obliged to do so, please respond..in writing sir." He said: "I will endeavor to do so ".. So I am seeking a response from HUD, according to this 45 days requirement. Mr. Dew's other threat is, "when we come up and _audit you we are going to find you in non- compliance ". My resonse has been.. "Sir, you have audited us for the last three years, and you have been the Auditor and have not found us in non-compliance. I wish to be ad- vised in writing promptly so that I can go to my Redevelopment Commission, have this resolved, and expedite the contracts ". So I am waiting for a wage determination request to be answered by HUD. Mr. Robinson: I would like to make one other comment, if I may, and then I will give up in support of Mr. Harcus. At various times we have received BNA reports on scattered site housing, it could be one or two, or whatever, and in the past, Mr. Dew has even put his sig- nature on the thing, and it was prevailing rates of the area. Why he is taking a position now all of a sudden, I do not know, and I am with Mr. Harcus, if he sends a letter to us, that is one thing, until he (Mr. Dew) does, as far as I am concerned, we will stick with our decision rendered in the past, and they will pay the pre- vailing rate, or they won't do it. Mr. Harcus: I have even pointed out to Mr. Dew Sir that we have letters showing that in recent years they have ruled on a specific wage on grant rehabilitation action in the Model Cities Program, which is similar to ours. This morning he said, "I don't care about that, go see your attorneys and get their interpretation of that phrase ". Mr. Butler: We have made an interpretation of that in the past, as long ago as three or four years, and our interpretation has con- sistently been: 1. that we do have the latitude, it is a local option, and we have opted in favor of the prevailing wage rate; and secondly, with respect to the eight units in a program, as we are administering it now, we generally have eight or more individual residential units submitted or offered for bid, therefore, we auto- matically fall under the eight unit provision. Mr. Nimtz: Of course the other threat Kevin, is .. "we are going to find you in non - compliance when we come down to audit you ", that is the difficulty. South end Redevelopment Commission Specia Meeting April 20, 1978 6. NEW BUSINESS (Cont'd Mr. Butler: Well, it certainly is inconsistent. Generally, my understanding of the history of that regulation is that we have been pricing ourselves out of the market throughout the country, and unable to get bids because the prevailing rate is too high for a residential type of rehabilitation work. We have had a problem in the past of obtaining bids when we were bidding these on an individual house -by -house basis. Since we have gone to the multiple residence, the package deal, we have been much more successful. So this is not a problem here, and we don't need, at least this has been the determination in the past, the kind of relief or exception in the case of this program in order to get the job done. Mr. Nimtz: Mr. Brownell, what does it do to us if we get audited nine months from now, and they issue a non - compliance criticism? Mr. Brownell: I don't know exactly what they do under the community development program. I have never experienced that of course, since the community program is new. Over on our side of the fence, that was serious because we got our loan and grant money directly from HUD, and when you have a non - compliance, they issued another letter that said you can't use the money, and you can't spend the money. Mr. Wiggins: Is there an appeal on that kind of ruling at that level? I think Mr. Harcus raised a very valid point. Mr. Dew has approved and audited this sort of thing over several years now and he will look bad if he comes out and changes it now. Mr. Butler: It wouldn't be the first time. Mr. Brownell: The other thing, of course, is that these rates have always, in the past, been published in the Federal Register and somehow or other we never had any difficulty. We went to the Federal Register and found out the rate. Mr. Wiggins: I understand when we had Frank Alford on board, when we were into this thing on our own, that was one of his principle functions to make sure that they were in compliance on the rates. Mr. Brownell: Yes, Frank and I went to the library one time, as a matter of fact, to check the rate. -7- South Redevelopment Commission Specialend Meeting - April 20, 1978 6. NEW BUSINESS (Cont'd Mr. Harcus: I would like to say one final word on behalf of the Bureau of Housing. According to the regulations of HUD, we are not authorized to arbitrarily go to the Federal Register and apply the rate published. It says in here that the Federal Register publication must be addressed to HUD, and HUD will then approve that as appropriate and readdress it to you in South Bend. So, what,we have ever done in the past hasn't really been correct. This regulation says we must take the Federal Register. Mr. Brownell: Well, Frank always went to HUD for his rates, and HUD has to go to the Department of Labor. They don't have the right to go to the newspaper either. They have to ask the Department of Labor for the correct rate. Mr. Harcus: Just in case some member thought I could go to the Federal Register and pick out a page and present it there, I am not authorized to do so. The other aspect is; this morning Mr. Dew said, "If I find you in non - compliance, you will have to refund the money ". I asked him... "What reference point would you use as to the cost rebate, because you have no reference point Mr. Dew is saying that there is a prevailing wage different than we have published and that if they have been over - paying us, then we will have to pay them back. There is no published or existing reference point that he can tell us to pay back a dollar or two dollars. That was the threat used. So, I ask you to look favorably upon the request we have placed before your board this morning; appreciating that we are representing the Commission, we do not promise that we will solve this to your satisfaction, but we will endeavor to do so. Mr. Dave Anderson: What is the problem? You are bidding these jobs, over a package, like three or four homes, am I correct -in this particular contract here? Mr. Brownell: There are eight in this one. Mr. Dave Anderson: So the problem is that if the prevailing wage is used, and you are using it on eight dwellings, or family dwellings of eight, or is that just for apartments, or apartment buildings? Mr. Wiggins: The problem is...we think we can understand HUD regulations, but the HUD people have a little problem with them. South B Special Redevelopment Commission ting April 20, 1978 6. NEW BUSINESS (Cont'd r. Nimtz: HUD is threatening that when they audit us, that his will be a non - approved expenditure, and we would have to come p with the money from someplace else to put back into the pot. A mo ion was made by Mr. Robinson for disapproval of the award of the contract to Jurtin's Construction Company, seconded by Mr. Donaldson, and it was carr ed. r. Brownell: Do you wish to pass on the other two contracts? s. Derbeck: Is Jurtin's contract based on prevailing wage cale or not? r. Robinson: I don't believe it is. r. Wiggins: All of the contracts are probably based on the age scale that they were provided with. r. Robinson: Yes, the wage scale that Mr. Harcus has. s. Derbeck: Is that the wage scale that you usually use? r. Harcus: Yes, ma'am. s. Derbeck: Then HUD does not approve? Harcus: No, this is the prevailing wage that we have published r the last year. We have asked for an update of that to ensure at this is either an update or has to be updated. r. Wiggins: In view of your communications with the gentleman from UD, do you have any assurance that this time the wage scale would be pproved and would not be to their disapproval? r. Harcus: If a wage scale is proper, the regulation says there is o conclusion date when the prevailing wage publication terminates. ou can go on using it. . Wiggins: This wage scale that you have, was it furnished to u by HUD, and does it have HUD's approval? . Harcus: I don't know what preceded my arrival here sir. South B Special 6. NEW Redevelopment Commission ting April 20, 1978 INESS (Cont'd r. Wiggins: Well then, that puts this wage scale in doubt just s the current wage scale is published in the register is in doubt. f HUD has threatened us with not approving any of these or paying ny of these contracts, we are as bad off with one as we are with he other. In fact, I think at this point until we can get HUD ff the dime, we hardly dare approve any kind of a contract. Harcus: In most cases where I have spot checked the existing blication I have found reference point. In other words, I have and that a year ago the carpenters did get paid $7.35 hourly. would have a large degree of confidence that at one time this evailing rate was appropriate to our community. r. Wiggins: That is before Mr. Dew said he wouldn't pay. hat is before he said what they approved of, and I think we should ump the threat back in the guy's lap, in other words, get on or et off. . Harcus: I believe this will all fall on me. r. Nimtz: No, I don't believe so. You told Mr. Dew you wanted it n writing, which I believe is very good; so let's see what r. Dew comes up with. r. Wiggins: Would it be any advantage to initiate communication etween this Commission? r. Nimtz: I think it would be well if Mr. Butler wrote to Mr. Dew nd told him this item was on our agenda this morning and followed discussion, and explain exactly what happened to him. r. Wiggins: We should tell him plainly that we can't operate ithout some kind of punitive direction. Particularly, as long as e are being subjected to threat in this area. r. Robinson: I have dealt with Mr. Dew and I do not know what direction e will go in; you can never keep up with him. I am not assured what irection he is going to take, so I want to find out something, but certainly don't approve with what he is saying now. Mr. diggins made a motion that the Director and Council be authorized to or directed to enter into such communications, and establish exactly what wage scales HUD will approve, seconded by Mr. Robinson and it was carried. Mr. Donaldson made a motion that the other two bids be tabled until the next Cotrried. ission meeting to be held on May 5th, 1978, seconded by Mr. Wiggins and it was -10- South B Special Redevelopment Commission eting - April 20, 1978 6. NEW BUSINESS (Cont'd . Butler: Would you like to do that with Jurtin's Construction mpany as well? Mr. obinson moved that the previous motion (to table two bids) be rescinde and be reconsidered, and that the question of all three bids be placed o the Agenda for the next meeting, seconded by Mr. Wiggins and carried. r. Dave Anderson: What happens now to the housing contracts that ou have approved earlier, using the figures that now appear to be n doubt? . Nimtz: The question has never been raised on those up until ase particular contracts. . Dave Anderson: It has been raised on these particular ones? . Nimtz: Apparently, yes. r. Dave Anderson: What happens now...do you have to wait word for ny other contracts to go,so in effect housing rehabilitation is stymied ntil you get direction from HUD? Mr. Brownell: Mr. Anderson, we have been under general duty on all contracts to get an update on wage before they bid, and normally it went through Frank Alford and he went to HUD. HUD would then go to the Department of Labor and get the updated wage scale, and we used that in our contracts. We had to have it checked within ten days of the con- ference with the bidders. So, it has been a normal procedure to get an updated wage scale from HUD all along. For some reason they are not getting it now, I don't know why. Mr. Donaldson: Well, who is responsible for that? Mr. Brownell: Well, normally, we went through Frank Alford, who was the man who handled wages, and now Anita L. Fields has that position of checking on the contractor, and holding the conferences, and getting an update of wages. Mr. Nimtz: Anything further? If not, we will proceed with the next item. Mr. Scott: If the scales are changed, would these packages have to be re -bid? Mr. Robinson: I believe so. Mr. Harcus: Regulations say that you do not re -bid them if the prevailing wage corms in after the opening. -11- South 6 nd Redevelopment Commission Special Meeting - April 20, 1978 6. NEWIBUSINESS (Cont'd r. Nimtz: Well, that may be true, but he is taking the attitude... r. Wiggins: I think that we should know before we award these ontracts that HUD would be even willing to pay them at the wage dale that was published in this. Nimtz: This is the difficulty, as you really don't know what Dew's stand is. Ir. Butler: When the contract was let for bid, or offered for ublic bidding, at that point, were we using a published wage ,ate and were the contractors who were bidding informed specifically n the bid documents? That was a condition of their bid. Ir. Harcus: Yes, and it happens to say in the regulations... "the ew wage determination shall prevail except that if the bids have een opened, such changes of modifications shall not be effective. r. Butler: So, in other words, if they do provide us with a new age scale, we can still except these bids as they were received, owever, the enforcement of wage rates would be according to the Id scale, not with the new scale. r. Wiggins: Along with the approval of, or a determination of hatever the current wage scales that they are willing to approve, would like a reaffirmation or affirmation of the wage scales that ere submitted to the contractors and were in the packages at the ime that these were bid; because I don't want to see this come round six months from now or a year from now, and they say... "hey ou guys gave these guys the wrong amount of money, and we aren't oing to pay you ", or we want our money back, I don't want to hear ither one of those things. r. Brownell: I am surprised, because we have always had to get n updated wage scale. r. Tony Scott: In the bid package, there is a statement that the id would be awarded to the lowest and best, and also take into oncern a minority (employees). What I really want to know is how uch weight does a minority employee have, because in trying to id the contract, and knowing that it has some weight, and knowing he amount of skill among minority employees employed, it is pretty hort. This means that the employees that you get, a big percentage f them are (minimum wage for labor, I believe is $6.95), are not oing to produce $6.95 worth of labor, so your man hours go up. -12- South B�nd Redevelopment Commission Special Meeting - April 20, 1978 6. NEW BUSINESS, Continued Mr. Scott, continued: Now if you could bid and the minority factor had nothing to do with it, you could get a better bid. You try to get the best people, not using a minority (criteria) or whatever, because you are looking for people who can produce. It takes quite a bit of money just to bid on these contracts (10 %) and that is tied up. You will find a lot of contractors who will refuse to bid according to these rules. When you start a new business you try to listen to some of the old pro's and yet you want to get in- volved in this. If this minority thing has weight, then you want to see that the bidder who wins the contract does have some minority employees. I am speaking of minority employees in regards to dollar and hourly problems. Mr. Wiggins: This factor is involved, there is no question about it. Mr. Robinson: If you are the minority contractor person, it does not say that you have to have a total work force of minorities, it just says that you have to have an anticipated goal..you have to pay them scale wages. We want to get the wage scale so the working people do not get cheated and are making a decent living. That is not doing us any good if you get a work force and we are sorry if he is un- qualified but he has to be qualified if you are to make a decent living and make a profit on your business. We can't have wage rates established and then let you break it down two or three ways because the people aren't qualified. Mr. Scott: I understand that, but I am saying that if you put zero and you have the lowest bid but some guy was right over you with three minority employees, would he get the contract award over you? Mr. Robinson: It doesn't say anything about employees, it refers to an "anticipated goal ", it says "minority contractor ". Mr. Scott: It says "amount" of minority employees and this is the thing we are concerned about. Mr. Harcus: There are really two aspects to your question Sir. One is your minority goal as a contractor, whether the contractor be caucasian or black.That is controlled for the Redevelopment Commission by the Equal Employment Opportunity Office who says they will have a program to hire and train minority members. That is in practice in every contract and the EEO officer meets with every contractor and insures that the Affirmative Action Program is being complied with. That Affirmative Action Program is taken care of by a lady in the next office who is working for the City. The second aspect is that part of the contract which refers to our giving considerable con- sideration to preference for minority contractors working or living within the target areas. Now we have minority contractors who are active in our program and we show them how to use the contract as - 13 - South end Redevelopment Commisson Special Meeting - April 20, 1978 6. NEWS BUSINESS, Continued collateral with the bank so they can borrow money to pay their bills - in case they are not substantially funded. We go out of our way to encourage assist minority contractors residing in target areas. Mr. Scott: OK, maybe I was misled somewhere. My concern was not be- cause the company was not considered a minority contractor, because I don't believe there is any way you could look at the papers and tell if it was a minority contractor. I am speaking of employees. We don't really want to be known as a minority contractor. I don't believe there is anything in the bid package that would tell you if the bidder was a minority contractor or not..which I believe is good. Mr. Wiggins: This is supposed to be the same deal for everybody. All the contractors try to hire minority employees where they can. The contractors are supposed to set up a target of what they propose to do, including hiring and training of minorities. One of the objects is to train more people in the skills and particularly, those people in the area we are servicing, and minority people. If, in truth, everybody is operating under the same set of rules and operating in the same gashion, then one will balance the other. One of the jobs of the Equal Employment Opportunity Office is to check this out and make sure that the contractor is operating that way. I suppose if you were down to the point where you have two firms bidding against each other and both came up with an equal bid, then you would get into these other factors and weigh one against the other. I don't believe I have ever seen that happen. Mr. Scott: That was my only question. If one had one minority em- ployee and the other had three, the latter would be accepted. r. Wiggins: I have never seen that happen. What I have seen happen s that we have not taken the lowest bid on some occasions because he low bidder had a bad performance record. Ir. Butler: Mr. Wiggins, using your example, if mployees are minorities and the other contractc ew hundred dollars over your bid and 50% of his inority employees, that would not (favor him) s he bidders were meeting the affirmative action r numbers is not weighed by the commission or, dvisory board, the neighborhood advisory board, say 20% of your r comes in with a employees are o long as both of plan ... the percentage I presume, by the in their recommendation. . Robinson: We would have no way of knowing what the employee keup is. b) Commission approval requested for Section 312 Loan Applications for the following: Mr. Thomas C. Anders $6,200.00 18 /SOU- 2/23/1 -76 -78 2101 S. Kendall St. - 14 - South end Redevelopment Commission Special Meeting, April 20, 1978 6. NEW BUSINESS Continued (b) Mr. Timothy Bottorff 1608 S. Fellows St. $5,500.00 18 /SOU -2- 24/1 -76 -78 Mr. Brownell read the details of the above 312 loans and Mr. Wiggins then moved for approval of both — motion seconded by Mr. Robinson and carried. 7. PROGRESS REPORTS Mr. Brownell: Resolution #550 was taken before the Area Plan Com- mission on Tuesday evening, April 18th, 1978, where it was unani- mously approved and we are now preparing a Resolution to go before the City Council at the first meeting they hold. Mr. Wiggins: What about MACOG, when does it get there? Mr. Brownell: We go to MACOG after the public hearings - then they make the A -95 review in MACOG. 8. NE4T COMMISSION MEETING The next Commission Meeting will be held on Friday, May 5, 1978 at 10:00 A.M. DISCUS ION Ms. De beck: Do you have anything to say at this time about the lawsuit? Mr. Butler: Mum is the word. Mr. Brownell: I have nothing to report other than what our attorney reported at our last meeting. Mr. Butler: Basically, Mr. Chapleau is simply waiting now for the various papers to be filed, the briefs and so forth. Ms. De beck: They haven't filed the transcripts yet? Mr. Bu ler: AS of a week ago, I believe the transcripts had been filed, but the br efs have not been ..... there was no further comment from the floor. 9. AD OURNMENT Th re being no further business to bring before the Commission, the me ting was adjourned at 10:53 A.M. - 15 - South Bend Redevelopment Commission Speci 1 Meeting, April 20, 1978 01 1* mtz, President -" C. Wayne`94e 611, Executive Director ment Commission - 16 - J .1 W W D rn m s C1 fD -A �A ^h P Q N C+ -s Vt h (D --+'C7 O rD 'C7 rn 0 0 OZ) co 0 C-+ `5 -•• 3� N �r _� J (D c V) o n O ? -5 (D (D V) -5 -S CD D ) rD '-1 � - ---1 S J c+ O (n rt / i (D N N N V1 _,. \ n O t-t ✓. C1 ti c+ (D :3 (D (D C < ru (D J W W S'`O .A N W c+ SL V) (D Ln c-} (n 'g -S Ul cn O O O n cn _-x V) = O Cn O cn O Ln O N Cn O rD rt N -- A) n SL Co �. r r (f D O .. 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